The VW Experience

My wife and I ordered what was to be our first VW on September 12, 2002. We ordered the car and placed a deposit on a 2003 1.8T GLS Jetta Wagon. We made it clear that we would be selling my car to generate funds toward a down payment on the Jetta. We were promised delivery within 60 – 80 days (somewhere between November 14 &, December 5 2003).Since my car sold very quickly, we figured we would have to make due with one car.

I called Roger Burdick Volkswagen during the first two months to check the status of the order with the salesman. I was told that the order had been submitted, but was not showing up as a build request as of yet. As such, they could not give me a definite build date.

Upon discover a very attractive option. I once again contacted the salesman, in an effort to add a sports package to the car. I was told that the car was too close to production to make any changes; and the salesman sited some build status that prevented any changes from being made.

When I called VW of America to look into making the change, I was told that the dealers are operated independently, and that any changes were at the dealers discretion. The dealer offered to add the sports package (different springs and wheels) upon arrival for upwards of $2,500 when the package is a $1,000 option.

We really wanted the Jetta, but my wife was growing increasingly frustrated.

December 21, 2002: The Dealership (salesman) assured us that the car was to arrive on Sunday, December 22 and promised that we could take delivery by Monday December 23. We were once again excited and decided to take a cruise out to the parking lot to se if we could spot the car. There did not appear to be any new arrivals on the lot or on the adjacent overflow lot.

It would have been nice to have been updated (good or bad) by the sales person but we received no phone call and as such I had to call them myself. I was informed that the car had not been delivered and was further informed that they didnt know where it was because of an in transit status. In transit apparently meant that it could be on the ship, in port, on the dock, or on a car transporter on its way to the dealership in Syracuse. Even though we are both excited about the car, we both have growing concerned about taking delivery because of the initial hassle we have experienced.

December 24, 2002:The salesman called at 7:00 to tell us that the car had yet to arrive. I told him that I appreciated that he called, as it is a courtesy that any customer is owed. He noted that due to the holidays, they expect that the car will be delivered by no sooner than Wednesday, December 31, 2003. When I mention that this is New Years Eve day, the salesman tells me that the dealership is open for business that day.

December 28, 2002: I continue to be disappointed. Not one word from the dealer about the car. No assurance that it is transit. We are going to wait until Thursday and see what happens. We have decided that if the wagon is not delivered as promised, we are going to take our business to another manufacture as VW and Burdick dont seem to have their act together.

December 31, 2002: I have not heard from the dealership and so once aging I called the salesman. He said the car had not arrived and attributed the shipping problems to VWs transport company, Swift Transportation. He informed me that he had been able to locate the car and informed me that he was making every effort to assure delivery on Wednesday January 3, 2003. According to him, the car has had reportedly been sitting in port in Boston since December 26th, and had not been processed for shipping to the dealer. He explained that it had kind of been lost in the mix. The salesman assured me that he and the sales manager had spoken with the area Volkswagen representative and the transporter to make sure the car arrives as promised on the third.

January 3, 2003: No word from the dealership so I went to Roger Burdick VW in person and spoke with our salesman in person. I gave him notice that if the car were not delivered in a weeks time, I would be requesting that my security deposit be returned, and would refuse to take delivery of the car. He responded by becoming very agitated. He yelled at me and told me he knew that my wife and I were going to screw him. He went on to say that every ****ing time he special orders a car he gets screwed and he will never do it again.

I told him that this was not my problem and that I expected delivery and demanded to know the whereabouts of my car at this time. He told me he would not be able to track it because of its in transit status.

My salesman had previously told us that he had worked for UPS. I asked him to draw on his experience and tell me why it was that UPS could track a package anywhere in the world, but Volkswagen (and Burdick VW) could not locate a $ 20,000 car?

He spoke with another associate who was able to locate the car. They informed me that it was on the dock in Boston. They assured me that they wold see to it that it was located and loaded for transit.

I told the salesman that I wanted to be updated every few days, good news or bad, in order to help me decide my course of action. I was once again assured that the car would be delivered on January 3, 2003.

He offered to compensate us by throwing in a free oil change and a tank of gas. Oil changes (the first three) are a complimentary service offered by Burdick and a full tank of gas is a courtesy, if not a state regulation.

I have been told that the car will arrive on the 6th of January. I made it clear that if we are not able to take delivery of the car on this date, I will take my business to another dealer.

January 5, 2003: motivated by curiosity and a glimmer of hope, I once again cruised the dealer lot trying to locate a blue Jetta Wagon. None are to be found. Looked in every corner of the lot and the garage and still nothing. There is nothing to do but wait until tomorrow to see if they do the right thing and call. If they have not called by noon, I am going to call them and insist on a loaner until I take delivery of the car.

January 6, 2003: Got a call from the salesman today at 12:00. The car came in this morning! They said it would be prepped in time for us to take delivery by 6:00 p.m. The salesperson was extremely polite and apologetic when we came to pick up the car. He made it a point of being there even though it was his day off. We took delivery of the car at 6:30 and drove it home in a light snowfall.

January 20, 2003: We got the wagon in Indigo Blue with 1.8T, 5 speed, gray leather, and Monsoon System. The Monsoon System is a bit disappointing and I have corresponded with VW enthusiast on vwvortex and this seems to be a common complaint. For the money we paid, I was expecting better sound system than our other car standard radio.

February 16, 2003: Having a problem with ice building up in the passenger and driver side front door jams near the hinge area of the wagon.
From what I can tell, water is trickling down in each corner of the plastic cowling and then deposits in the door jams. There is a piece of plastic strip that looks like it was designed to seal this area and keep this from happening but it would appear that it is not working. When either door is opened, it crunches the ice as it comes into contact with it. The ice buildup does not leave much clearance to swing the doors open and it is necessary to gently pry the door open in order to get enough clearance to get into the car. I am seeing about a 1/4 to 1/2 inch build up of ice on both sides of the car on the passenger and drivers side. I am afraid that this will damage the hinges or more likely the door.

When I happen to see our salesman at the Syracuse auto show, I mention this to him and he says they all do that.

This is happening almost every day. I remove the buildup and it’s back the next day.

I am theorize that if heat from the engine is melting the snow / ice on the cars hood and cowling it may be causing the problem. I make an extra effort to ensure that the car is well cleaned off in an effort to reduce the build up yet it continues to occur.

I have never had this happen with any car (make or model) I have owned, and have growing concerns that the bottom most portion of the door is going to eventually get bent and damaged.

November 27, 2003: At 10,000 miles I have noticed a small oil leak on the wagon and took it in for service. They found that the intercooler was leaking due to a faulty O-ring seal. They said they would have to reschedule the appointment because they didn’t have the part in stock and had my wife drive the car home.

While on the way to Thanksgiving dinner, I was getting onto the highway and while accelerating up the on ramp, heard whoosh, then a pop noise. The car lost power and made a hissing, whooshing noise from the right front of the car. For fear that something bad had, or would happen, we parked it and took another car to dinner. When the car was brought back in for service they needed to give a loaner car because they had received the wrong parts to repair our car. Turns out that when they inspected for the oil leak they forgot to tighten up some hose clamps and the intercooler coupling came undone.

January 12, 2004: I am having two problems with our Wagon and do not know if they are related.

On Saturday, January 7, 2004 when it was about 5 degrees out side, I had the clutch go to the floor and it would not come back up. After some fiddling with the car (shut it off, started it while in gear clutch on floor, let it sit for about 8 hours) the clutch worked again.

The second problem is the car just cant seem to get out of its way in regard to traction in the snow. I have a set (4) of very good snow tires on the car and it cant make it up the driveway without spinning.
With traction control on, the car has no power and just bogs down. With it off, it cant seem to get traction, as the wheels break loose, and spin even with delicate throttle modulation.

I dont have this problem with our other car which seems able to go through any amount of snow with little or no difficulty with very similar snow tires on it. In fact, I usually drive the other car up the driveway and then stage the Jetta for my wife as I am tired of getting phone calls to rescue her because she cant get up out of the driveway.

The driveway is not that steep so I dont know how it could be a factor.
I contacted the Dealership to report both problems and they stated the clutch to the floor issue may be the result of moisture in the clutch plate assembly. They report that they have had received several calls in the past few days with similar complaints and attribute it to the string of consistently cold days. They tell me to monitor it and if occurs again, bring it in for service.

As an aside, I tell them that not only am I experiencing a build up of ice in my doors, they are freezing shut at times. They respond yeah they do that, as if its acceptable. My wife, who is the primary driver of this car, calls me at least once a week crying, to tell me her car is frozen shut and that she cant get into it. She was seven months pregnant at the time and several occasions where she had to forced the passenger side door open and then apply pressure with her feet on the drivers door to get it to open as she was unable to climb over the center console in her condition.

Unsatisfied with the service departments response, I call VW of America.

VW of America takes note of my concerns and then calls me back two weeks later. They inform me that my VW is equipped with a highly sophisticated hydraulic clutch and as such, it may at times, be affected by inclement. When I tell the representative that my 76 Saab, 92 Honda, 94 Honda, and 01 Focus all have had hydraulic clutches and have never experienced this problem they have no response.

They go on to tell me that all cars experience ice build / accumulation and doors freezing shut. They noted that this had been a particularly harsh winter across the country and as such, I should expect some freezing. Even when informed that I have never experienced anything like this and even when I tell them that my other car has not had similar problems, they have no response.

Lastly they say something that I found insulting. They tell me that the reason my car performs poorly in the snow is because I have equipped the car with inferior snow tires. Once again, when I inform them that my car is equipped with the same snow tires that their dealer offers locally, they have nothing to say.

My concerns are systematically dismissed and or explained away. In sharing my concerns on the Vortex I am sometimes chastised for being critical of Volkswagen. I decide t embrace the idiosyncrasies of my car VW as part of the ownership experience and make the best of it as its resale value has plummeted and I have no choice but to keep the car.

September 28, 2004: Took car in for service at Burdick VW of North Syracuse after experiencing problems with the clutch on September 26, 2004 (18,600K). Spoke with the Service Manager, Mr. Scott ****, and asked that they test the car with four adults onboard as the problems seem to occur when the car is under load. Also asked that they find a hill and problems are most evident on inclined plane.

Mr. Scott **** Contacted me to let me that they were unable to replicate the problem but due to the smell of burnt clutch, they were going to pull the transmission to inspect the clutch to see if there were any identifiable problems.

September 29, 2004: Contacted Scott **** at 4:30 p.m. (he has not called me) to inquire about the status of my car. Was told and discovered that the clutch was worn. He informed me that it was not covered under warrantee (only covered for the first 12K) and asked if he could call back to provide an estimate for the work. Scott called back and quoted me a price of just under $1,800.

I informed Scott that I was not willing to pay for repairs and informed him that I would be perusing Lemon Law status for the car because of the ongoing transmission related problems I have experienced since taking delivery of the car. Scott provided the customer service number (1-800-822-8987) and informed me that I would have to pursue Lemon Law with VW of America.

Spoke with Shawn **** at VW customer service at 1-800-822-8987 and informed her of my ongoing transmission problems. I told her that I wanted to seek Lemon Law status for the car due to the ongoing transmission related problems I have experienced. She informed me that I needed to take this up with the dealership, and noted that she would document my call and investigate my case. She informed me that she would get back to me within the next two weeks to tell me VW of Americas decision.

September 30, 2004: Returned to Burdick VW in North Syracuse at 9:00 a.m. and asked to speak with service manager. Was told by Scott **** that Mr. David **** would undoubtedly give me the same response as her had. Scott asked that I allow him and Mr. **** to advocate for me with the area quality assurance representative, and assured me that it was in his, and VWs best interest to resolve this matter in my favor so that they might continue to have my patronage.

Notified Scott that if the car were not repaired within seven days under warrantee as required by New York State Lemon Law, I would be pursuing Lemon Law status for the car.

I Sent Scott **** and David **** of Burdick VW in North Syracuse an email from the web site: http://www.myvwlemon.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000155.html in an effort to document that my clutch failure problems are not unique.

Contacted VW via 1-800-822-8987 to request a copy of both my email and phone correspondence with them. The representative refused to release info siting company policy that prevents her from doing so. Even when informed that New York Lemon Law entitles me to such documentation she refused and suggested that I contact VW o America in writing.

October 1, 2004 / 12:30 p.m.: Attempted to contact Mr. Roger Burdick 452-**** in an effort to make sure that all options to resolve this problem were explored. I was unable to reach him directly but left a detailed message on his assistance voice mail. I explained that my car was at his VW dealership with a failed clutch and that both the dealership and VW of America were currently refusing to cover the repairs under warrantee. I also informed him that as a result of having to wait until October 7, 2004 to have my car inspected by a VW area rep, I was without transportation, which is a significant inconvenience to me. I left my cell phone number and asked that I be called back.

October 2, 2004 · Filed under Uncategorized

90 Comments »

  1. VDub Said,

    October 2, 2004 @ 9:03 am

    The VW Experience – The ice build up problem has been fixed, should be a recall I believe. They put a piece of foam on either side of the vehicle to stop the water from building up. If you have not gotten that fixed yet, I would ask them next time you go in. I wish you luck with your Clutch problem, I know it can be a pain to deal with what they will and won’t cover sometimes.

  2. Chombi Said,

    October 2, 2004 @ 11:39 am

    The VW Experience – You’re definitely deep into the typical VW ownership nightmare. Volkswagens from the last two decades are ususally only good for test drives. They seem to be made up of parts that are meant to just last long enough to get you to sign that lease or purchase agreements and a couple of monthly payments. After that, all bets are off, as far as the dealers and VWoA is concerned. it’s like they’re telling you with a smirk in their faces “FarTfenugen in your Turdwagen!!”

  3. Shomare Said,

    October 3, 2004 @ 12:11 pm

    The VW Experience – My car has the foam blocks installed and they have failed to prevent ice build up.

    I can see it resulting in the bottom of the door being damaged as it pries against the ice.

    Unfortunately, I must open the door to gain access to the ice, so some crunching in inevitable.

    As far as the door moldings go, I plan to coat them with silicone spray if (and thats big if) I get the car back. This is something the dealer could have done or recommended back when I complained about the doors freezing shut. Instead they stated that they all do that and sited a harsh winter.

  4. Shomare Said,

    October 4, 2004 @ 4:50 am

    The VW Experience – Its now 6:00 p.m. The day has come and gone an I have yet to hear back from a representative of the Burdick Cooperation despite having been promised a return call by the end of the day in regard to the use of a loner car. I will call back in the morning in an effort to once again request a loner vehicle. as tomorrow will be one week since I dropped my car off for service.

  5. chrismelton Said,

    October 4, 2004 @ 8:03 am

    The VW Experience – I think I would switch dealers. If I did that to my customers I would not have any.

  6. Ivan Said,

    October 4, 2004 @ 9:31 am

    The VW Experience – I had the same clutch problem with Toyota Camry that I had. Now what?

  7. Shomare Said,

    October 4, 2004 @ 10:11 am

    The VW Experience – October 4, 2004 10:50 a.m.: I have yet to hear from any representative of Burdick Auto Mall. As such, I call them back. I once again ask to speak with Mr. Burdick. This time I am transferred to his personal secretary who acknowledges that they received my call. I tell her I am requesting a loaner car until Volkswagen makes a decision about coving the repairs to my car. I am then transfers to another representative whos responsibility it is to oversee such matters. He tells me that he became aware of my call late Friday afternoon and has been in contact with the VW service manger. He tells me that the service manager is working with VW to resolve the matter, as the clutch is not covered under warrantee. I explain to him that I am without a car while our Volkswagen is in the repair shop and ask that I be provided with one since it is my understanding that this is a courtesy that Burdick automotive provides. He tells me that he is looking into doing justthat and will get back to me.

  8. chrismelton Said,

    October 4, 2004 @ 11:40 am

    The VW Experience – It sounds like your issues are mostly dealer related. The silicone spray on the doors and hinges is what I use in my shop on all customers vehicles, especially in the winter. If you had clutch problems earlier in your history, why are they giving you trouble? If it has been documented, and they have spoken to their area rep, I cannot see any reason to decline coverage, also note though, I do not have any supporting documents, but I would assume that if they contacted the rep, and told him the situation, I do not see any reason, for declination. I wish you luck on this issue.

  9. Shomare Said,

    October 4, 2004 @ 12:08 pm

    The VW Experience – When I called to report clutch problems, both the dealership and VW explained them away stating that hydraulic clutches may malfunction when the temperature drops.

    I didnt like the dealers response which was yeah they do that & we have had many calls about that this week due to the inclement temperatures.

    When I called VW of America to get a second opinion (since the dealer did not think it was a big deal they all do that and did not ask me to bring it in unless it did it again. VW Just reiterated what the dealer had said, but added some additional comments that I found condescending.

    When the car was taken in for service in the Spring, they could find nothing wrong.

    They (dealer and VW are now both saying that the warrantee does not cover the clutch beyond 12K. I am arguing that 18,600 is premature for a clutch to fail under normal driving conditions and as such am refusing to pay for repairs regardless of what the warrantee states, especially since I had sought assistance with a what appeared to be a malfunctioning clutch.

    The dealer says its VW of Americas issue VW of America says its the dealers issue.

  10. Shomare Said,

    October 5, 2004 @ 1:47 am

    The VW Experience – I wish I could take credit for keep such an accurate log but the fact is that we live in a marvelous time.

    With access to the Internet, I often took my complaints and concerns to vwvortex and other VW enthusiast sites. The wonderful thing about this is that all posts are time and date stamped each time you post.

    I was able to print it all out and or copy and paste my documentation. That coupled with my receipts and calendar of events enabled me to keep track and create this post. It was not all that hard or time consuming to do.

    I apologize for the lengthy post and I glad some of you read it. I felt it was important to not only document my experience but to share it with others, thus the lengthy post. A necessary evil if you will.

    Now the next obstacle will be to see if this next clutch holds up any better. I still fear that the master cylinder of hydraulic clutch is partly to blame. If they do not replace this as well, I could be in the same boat in another 18K. If that is the case I will Lemon Law the car, no if ands, or buts.

  11. jasenm Said,

    October 5, 2004 @ 5:10 am

    The VW Experience – one thing i can say, as a salesman, is factory orders are without a doubt a pain in the ass. while i never mutherf*** a customer (ok not to their face lol) it is truly a bother because of the time factor. its so true that the more time you spend with a customer the less $$$$ you make and ultimately less likely you will even sell them a car at all. vw is not alone here, at dodge we factory order often for durangos and vipers, and same thing. you cant make a person put down a non refundable deposit, so all it means is they have to come back to see you at least once. and all the calling is another thing. as a salesman, i have no access to find out where your vehicle is at the drop of a dime, though i would love to have that. believe me managers are not very eager to keep checking. not bitching, but it can be a pain, like i said….so now you know where i am coming from a bit.

  12. Shomare Said,

    October 5, 2004 @ 10:14 am

    The VW Experience – October 5, 2004 9:40 a.m.: I was contacted by the General Manger Mike Gould 699-2661 Of Burdick Porsche, Audi, Volkswagen. Mr. Gould asked for me to give him an account of my concerns which I did. He assured me that the Service Manger was advocating for me with VW of America and would be in contact with me at some point today.

    I informed Mr. Gould that I thought it was unacceptable for the cars clutch to fail at 18K and also informed him that it was my intention to seek lemon law status for the car should VW of America refuse to repair it. He again assured me that the service manger had been working diligently to resolve the matter.

    I let Mr. Gould know that I have been without transportation for a week as of today and requested that I be provided with a rental or loner car. He told me that they have only seven loner cars in their fleet, but would make the Service manager aware of my needs.

    October 5, 2004 10:0 0 a.m.: Scott Leonard, Volkswagen Service Manger of Burdick Volkswagen calls me. He tells me that he has been able to obtain approval threw his contacts which will allow him to repair the car at no cost to me. Additionally, he provided a phone number for a local car rental provider (Enterprise) and authorized me to rent a car. The dealership has agreed to pay up to $30.00 a day. I thanked Scott for his efforts, and let him know that I will do everything I can to ensure that his efforts get acknowledged. He believes that he will have the car repaired by Friday, Monday, October 11, 2004 at the latest.

  13. 297 Said,

    October 5, 2004 @ 10:28 am

    The VW Experience – Well, better late than never. Unfortunate that it probably was due to your requesting transcripts and documents, plus sending an email through the lemon law site, that spurred VWoA to get off its ass and give your dealership a prod.

    Typically, VWoA IS lazy, and they tend to let the dealer handle the situation to their advantage, but if you prompt them enough, and by prompt I mean do the things you just did, not just call and yell, they will finally make an effort, and usually that effort entails exactly what they promised: free repair and a loaner effective immediately.

  14. jasenm Said,

    October 5, 2004 @ 11:59 am

    The VW Experience – shomare, i love to read. i started reading your post and was intrigued by the detail of your complaints. however, that is the longest, most aggrivating post i have ever read. are those dates accurate? what do you do schedule your potty breaks, too? look, man, im not making light of your problems. this ice buildup was a problem in 2002 jettas, along with the more famous coil problems. i have seen no problems in the 03 or 04 models, and the 05s just got here a week agao. but man o man i could not make it thru that post. cool out on the dates and times. i hope you get your car back on time, really i do. but i do not need to know if you pick it up at 3:43 or 3:44 pm!

  15. rick Said,

    October 5, 2004 @ 12:05 pm

    The VW Experience – shomare clearly kept a log. It makes a whole lot of sense to be able to point to times and places and names with accuracy.

    Me? I’m lucky if I recall the month that something happened.

  16. chrismelton Said,

    October 5, 2004 @ 12:12 pm

    The VW Experience – I wish more customers kept logs like this, and had paperwork to back it up. From a service standpoint, it makes life a lot easier for the service manager to go “to bat” for someone, and makes the technicians life a lot easier diagnosing. My hat is off to you for documentation. Hopefully they are getting everything resolved for you. I still feel that this is a dealer issue. VW customer relations does depend on the dealer for input and does back the dealer. So if the situation is not resolved I would look at the dealer….. The dealer can only do so much and has policies and procedures to follow, but that has never stopped me from “going the extra mile” for my customers. And if the dealer has gone the extra mile for you, and VW still won’t budge, then the next course of action has to be decided by you.

  17. Shomare Said,

    October 7, 2004 @ 5:19 am

    The VW Experience – Wow, it just keeps getting better.

    I had thought that the master cylinder for the hydraulic clutch might be responsible for creating the premature failure of the clutch and was concerned that without replacing it, I would be facing the same problem in another 18K

    The dealership called today and told us that they have everything in for reassembly but the master cylinder.

    So it seems we are getting not only a new clutch assembly but the master cylinder as well. Sounds like they are taking very good care of us.

  18. Shomare Said,

    October 11, 2004 @ 5:16 am

    The VW Experience – October 10, 2004

    Out of the mouths of babes

    My 10 year old and I were talking today and she asked if I had gotten my car back yet. I told her no but that it was being fixed and we would have it back soon.

    She said, thats good daddy, I didnt feel safe riding in with it the car with it breaking down all the time.

    Didnt hear from VW today but thats ok because they have provided a rental car. Will have had it a week tomorrow. At a rate of $30 a day, thats costing VW $210.00

  19. jasenm Said,

    October 12, 2004 @ 1:06 am

    The VW Experience – rick, look man, why do you get so upset because of a curse word from me, but its ok for shomare. real cute how you put your edit of my post in red and ****ed shomares in regular black. i know he used the f word orig. i read it myself and that is the only reason i used it again. to say i never used the word to a customer and that was wrong. ive seen sh*t in here a few times too. when exactly was the other time you edited my post, please tell me. you never have. so stop with the threats, its pointless banter. im not one of your students in a junior high classroom. if you are going to use your authority do it in a fair and non discriminitory fashion, for both vw supporters and visa versa. plus what took you so long, you posted after me and that was not in red last time i checked here, so exactly what is your problem with it. find one problem i have caused. you cant. find one person i have offended. none. find a few people i try to help? yep a few. i may not be quite as deep in mech. knowledge as paul or chris, but i’m no fool. those who have access to vwwebsource can find me on the site as a finalist in the touareg product knowledge comp. pics right there. so now do you still feel i dont know what im talking about? that ticked me off, man.

  20. Shomare Said,

    October 12, 2004 @ 1:39 am

    The VW Experience – Just got the car back and all I can say is WOW!

    The clutch effort is so light that I thought that something was wrong with it. It requires so little effort compared to the way it has functioned since taking delivery of the car that it confirms my suspicion that it was defective from the beginning.

  21. Shomare Said,

    October 12, 2004 @ 2:01 am

    The VW Experience – I apologies about the use of profanity in my post. I was not using it for effect but in an effort to document what the Salesman had said to me, his words, not mine.

    I am use to sites that have build in swear filters and thought that the profane word would be edited out. I did not realize that a moderator would have to physically edit my post.

    One again I apologize. Hopefully VW will not provide me with any more opportunities that inspire the use such strong language.

  22. 297 Said,

    October 12, 2004 @ 3:38 am

    The VW Experience – I’m glad to hear your car’s issues have been resolved to your satisfaction, and especially glad that VWoA came to bat for you.

  23. rick Said,

    October 12, 2004 @ 9:11 am

    The VW Experience – Shomare, no problem on the language thing. But please understand that I built this thing brick by brick i.e. no pre-canned forums, no automated components… I’m a web applications developer by day but I manage this site by hand in my free time (I code every command) to keep my skills up. So no, I haven’t gone so far as to add a filter to replace swear words with *** or anything, nor do I think I should use my time that way. I depend on people to be prudent with their posts. When folks do post a swear (the f and c words only) I edit them when I have a chance. It’s very manual, but it’s also a nice opportunity to get in touch with the posts here.

    Jasenm, you’re right. Upon looking back, I didn’t need to edit you until this thread (I got you confused with another ****), but I have needed to reply to your insults in the past.

    Read the rules of engagement about swear words. Most are allowed, the F and C words are not. Yeah, I’m making it up as I go along but hey, it’s my personal site, and if I don’t get any other feedback from our regulars to the contrary, which I’d respect, then I think I need to keep some sort of civility here on my own. No harm, man… post as long as you add value.

    I removed my edit remarks with my apologies.

  24. jasenm Said,

    October 13, 2004 @ 5:10 am

    The VW Experience – rick,

    no problem. a accept your aplgy and offer mine 4 my part.

  25. Shomare Said,

    October 13, 2004 @ 7:54 am

    The VW Experience – Just got off the phone with VW Customer Care (theres an oxymoron for you) and they informed me that VW was going to stand by their policy to honor only the 12K warrantee on the clutch.

    I told them that the dealer had repaired the car, that I had picked it up yesterday, and that the car was operating well.

    Stick that in your pipe and smoke it VWoA

    I guess I owe a big thanks to Burdick VW for taking on the VW establishment for us.

    There is a side story where they called a body shop where I had some work done to inquire about the extent of the damages. Its only speculation but I think they may have been trying to connect the clutch failure to the accident.

    Just for the record, the clutch was acting up well before the accident occurred and has been documented as such.

  26. Shomare Said,

    October 18, 2004 @ 7:10 am

    The VW Experience – Things that make you go Hmmm.

    After never having received a follow up phone call from VwoA (customer satisfaction survey) they called tonight.

    Makes one wonder if they are in fact paying attention to this and other VW complaint sites.

    If you are here VwoA hear this; listen to your customers, dont talk down to them, make an effort to address problems promptly, and remember that your future success depends on the reliability of your product and a positive customer service reputation.

  27. Shomare Said,

    October 18, 2004 @ 10:10 am

    The VW Experience – Got a call if you could call it that. First time ever!

    Went like this:

    Rep: Hello this is Loretta from Burdick Auto. I see someone had there car in for some clutch work on Tuesday/

    Me: Yes, that was me.

    Rep: Has the clutch been repaired.

    Me: Yes, they took care of it and its operating very well.

    Rep: Thats good, thank you.

    Maybe they are reading my updates on this site since I sent it to them to let them know that I was not alone in my clutch problem.

  28. 297 Said,

    October 18, 2004 @ 11:20 am

    The VW Experience – Well, every time I show up at the dealer for service, I get a phone call a week or two later where they ask me to share my experiences. Sometimes it’s just a “Things were fine” to a long session of rating things from 1 to 5, 1 being poor, 5 being excellent, over the service, the cost, the friendliness, etc.

  29. jasenm Said,

    October 19, 2004 @ 5:56 am

    The VW Experience – isky does follow up on about 75% of all vw customers be they service or sales. vwoa rarely will make such a call themselves.

  30. Beck Said,

    October 22, 2004 @ 2:15 am

    The VW Experience – I don’t know how they even have time to do that, cause they are just so very busy!
    I remember going in to a VW service department so they can look at something on my airbox that they forgot to fix as promised under warranty (a clip on the secondary airpump hose to the airbox was not latching on properly, leading to a leak that was triggering the CEL light) I got to the counter and found four service persons joking around with half of them sitting back on their chairs, their feet up on their desks. first I stood there in front of their counter while they continue to joke around and laugh. I was standing there for almost five minutes, totally being ignored by these fools. I finally rapped my keys on the counter and one of them reluctantly dragged himself towards me. I told him to please look at what’s going on with that secondary air hose, because it seems that the mechanic who just worked on the car forgot to fix it even though it was listed on the service order The car was parked about 8 feet from the service counter, just right outside their glass door with it’s hood open. The guy tells me that he can’t do it! I asked him again to just look at it and note down the problem, so it will be clear when I do come back to have it fixed again. The Jerk answers that they were all too busy and he will just write me in for an appointment, maybe next week. I just couldn’t believe what I was hearing from this cretin. That was like the third time I was trying to get that item fixed with this dealership service department! I walked out of there telling him that I will never bring my car to them ever.
    This is just one reason why I hate the whole Volksyugo system. There’s just too many things bad about it. from their products down to the Volksyugo Service Department’s attitude. And no, it wasn’t the only dealership I had trouble with, I would say, at least 90% of the ones I have dealt with are run very badly by rude and incompetent personel. The car was only about a month old back then, and even that early, Volksyugo of America and their dealer service network was giving me reasons to hate them already.

  31. Ivan Said,

    October 22, 2004 @ 5:25 am

    The VW Experience – Beck, all the messages that you have posted have had been offensive to the VW and VW personel in one way or another. My personal conclusion is that maybe, just maybe, you are not a very pleasant person to deal with. In other circals the person, with your type of attitude would be simply called a Bi… (you finish it). Maybe that is why you get negative feedback from 90% of VW dealerships. I am sure when you come to the service, people can read everything on your face. Ive met people like you. No metter what you do it is just not good enough. It is not them, Beck. It is you! That is only one case where I could say that it is completely your fault. You are just one, unpleasant person. Change you attitude, and everything will get better. Nice people always get something extra, because we are so tired of dealing with ill people. I am nice to people like you (because it is my job). I am extra nice to people who are nice to me. You get what you deserve.

  32. Beck Said,

    October 22, 2004 @ 5:55 am

    The VW Experience – I’m only not pleasant to people who treat me like Volksyugo has been treating me. I would say I’m one of the nicest guys you can meet. If my Crtiticsm is hurting the feelings VW personel and others related to the company. Turn around and look at your bosses and the people at VWoA. That is the root of the problem. If they don’t change, We as unhappy owners of their substandard products will not change our feeling towards Volksyugo as a whole. You guys inside the company could be the best opportunity to make that company turn around and finally really care about how they treat us customers. We are not mad because we think it’s fun to be constantly complaining something always going wrong on our Volksyugo. I have every right to be mad and crtical of a comapny that took $26,000.00 (and counting) of my very hard earned money and then leaving me high and dry most of the time when something craps out on it prematurely. Hey, if you guys don’t help us improve the situation in Volksyugo, it could also mean less and less sales every year, which translates to layoffs in sales and production. You guys have a vested intrest in trying to maintain the reputation of the company you work in. So please stop the constant denials and the internal finger pointing at each other. Just take a good look at a part like the typical plastic thermostat housing that they put into my and thousands of other cars they built recently. See how bad the concept of depending on that wimpy O-ring that seals it against the engine block, then you might hopefully realize the typical substandard design approach the Volkyugo engineers put into such critical components. All the evidence is in front of you in the form of parts you constantly pull out of Volyugos everyday!

  33. 297 Said,

    October 22, 2004 @ 6:08 am

    The VW Experience – An example of friendly customer relations:

    paultakeda: Hi, I got a letter in the mail stating it was time for my 40k service.

    Timmons service: Yeah, we had you in for the 35k in May so it’s time to come in. The 40k is a big one, we need to check pretty much everything.

    paultakeda: I’ve only driven the car 1500 miles since then.

    Timmons service: Wow, that’s not much at all.

    paultakeda: So should I just change the oil, which I’ll do myself, and just do that every six months till I hit 40k, then make an appointment then?

    Timmons service: That sounds like the best thing to do.

    paultakeda: Okay, then, thanks.

    I like Timmons. They don’t cheat me. I don’t cheat them (they know about my modifications, including the turbo, exhaust, intake manifold gasket, etc.).

    Just an example.

    And beck is correct, if his dealer basically turned that above conversation into:

    VW: You need to come in for the 40k service.

    beck: But I’ve only driven 1500 miles these past six months.

    VW: Doesn’t matter. Six months or 5000 miles, whichever is sooner. You gotta come in, it’s a big one and it’ll cost you.

    beck: But that doesn’t make sense–

    VW: You don’t have to come in, but if you don’t, I’ll have to mark it here and your extended warranty will be limited.

    It could also go bad if beck did the following:

    beck: I’m not coming in after only driving 1500 miles to pay you guys all this money to check my belts!

    VW: Well, sir, that’s your choice, we were only–

    beck: Volksyugo bastards! I know what you guys are up to! I’ll see you in HELLLLLL!!!

    Not that that scenario is anywhere near the realm of reality. :D

  34. Beck Said,

    October 22, 2004 @ 6:09 am

    The VW Experience – I forgot to add Ivan,
    Your reply actually proves my point. It’s another instance of the attitude that pervades through Volksyugo system……blaming the customer again. A whole company, from top to bottom, in total denial! Yes it’s easy to throw barbs toward me and other unhappy Volkyugo customers in this site. Please just grow up and be more constructive and just relay your frustrations to your bosses and Volksyugo the company. Maybe then, we might get somewhere. They are the real bad guys in all of this.

  35. Beck Said,

    October 22, 2004 @ 6:16 am

    The VW Experience – Keep posting these messages and keep proving my point Paul, Ivan,….anyone else!
    By the way, love the A55clowning from Paul this time!

  36. jasenm Said,

    October 23, 2004 @ 1:24 am

    The VW Experience – g.i. beck is now drivine a toyohatsu.

  37. jasenm Said,

    October 23, 2004 @ 11:06 am

    The VW Experience – in becks world, he is like g.i. joe and vw is c.o.b.r.a. so i guess that makes paul the cobra commander, and ill be destro. ILL GET YOU JOES!!!!

  38. Ivan Said,

    October 23, 2004 @ 11:51 am

    The VW Experience – Beck, you are just ingnorant. We tried to be nice, but the Volksyugo did not go away.

  39. Chombi Said,

    October 24, 2004 @ 4:05 am

    The VW Experience – Nah, you guys got it all wrong! Beck, like all of us, drives a fantasticly horrible Turdwagen!

  40. ZX1100F1 Said,

    October 25, 2004 @ 1:08 am

    The VW Experience – Very long opener but some good information.
    But mostly what I got out of this thread is that jasenm is a serious crybaby and too lazy and low ranking to be able to check on a customers order-in.
    Keep those excuses coming, I love reading about what a loser you are.

  41. Beck Said,

    October 25, 2004 @ 2:22 am

    The VW Experience – No, Ivan,
    I am not “”ingnorant”", I am just smart enough so that I know when I’m getting ripped off by a no good car company! You’re frustration and hostility towards me just keeps proving that Volksyugo is mostly made up of people that couldn’t really care less about continuing problems that their customers have with their cars. So, I don’t really mind you calling me and other people on this site that have complaints towards Volksyugo names, specially if it represents to everyone the typical attitude that Volksyugo choses to display to the public.
    Keep em coming if you want to!

  42. Beck Said,

    October 26, 2004 @ 2:27 am

    The VW Experience – Who’s downgrading who?! you’re the one who called me “”ingnorant”".
    Next time read my post more carefully. My war isn’t a personal one against you or any so called Volksyugo fans, but if they start insulting me personally, I will have to respond. I am trying lately to be as impersonal about it as I can by at least injecting some humor into it. It’s the company that I have been always saying that is the root of “”Evil”". I don’t understand why you take the term “”Volksyugo”" too personally. It’s just a car and a car company. not your sister or brother or kid that I am making fun of.

  43. Ivan Said,

    October 26, 2004 @ 10:14 am

    The VW Experience – Beck, if you would of been smart enough the Volksyugo thing would of stoped long time ago. You do not have to downgrade somebody to prove the point.

  44. Ronster Said,

    October 27, 2004 @ 8:26 am

    The VW Experience – Whether you realize it or not (I’m thinking not), you’re representing your dealer and the brand jasenm. And you’re the perfect representative for the crap you sell. Arrogant without justification, noisy, and generally a pain in the ass with a whine that won’t go away.

  45. jasenm Said,

    October 27, 2004 @ 12:40 pm

    The VW Experience – the only one here flying around insults is zx. im a loser? lol! whatever man. they wont even allow people like you in my neighborhood, we have standards. then again can you even read this or is someone reading it to you, you throw around silly banter like a 6 year old. and about your comment about my being too lazy to check on an order, you dont know anything about the system to which you refer. there are only a few different status checkups on an ordered vehicle. its either:

    in transit to dealer – on the truck usually a few days out

    center stock – sitting at the local waiting to be put on a truck maybe a week or 2.

    rail – on the train 3 weeks or so

    port stock – on the east coast just off boat, a month out

    transit from factory – on the boat, 120 days out

    that simple enough for you? there is no one to call and no way to get it more detailed. customers dont understand this, like you dont understand something as simple as dr. seuss.

  46. jorgab Said,

    October 28, 2004 @ 2:43 am

    The VW Experience – this post is for rick. just a curious thought. how do you get away with letting someone post full names and phone #s to where theses people can be contacted, such as shomare has. you are the moderator. is it not your responisibility to protect someones privacy? just a thought, i have talked to a few lawyers regarding this and they seem to think there may be a privacy invasion case here. unless of course you have a signed waiver to allow there names to be posted, which i highly doubt. interesting you seem to be more worried about someone cursing than slander of an individual.

  47. rick Said,

    October 28, 2004 @ 7:59 am

    The VW Experience – To your points:

    how do you get away with letting someone post full names and phone #s to where theses people can be contacted, such as shomare has.

    Get away with what? What have I done other than provide you with a free public forum?

    you are the moderator.

    No I’m not.

    is it not your responisibility to protect someones privacy?

    No it’s not.

    just a thought, i have talked to a few lawyers regarding this and they seem to think there may be a privacy invasion case here.

    Lol! No you didn’t! Threaten me if it makes you happy but don’t lie to bolster your position!

    unless of course you have a signed waiver to allow there names to be posted, which i highly doubt.

    It’s spelled “their”. And what waiver? You can’t really think I have that kind of time… I suggest you REALLY talk to an attorney if you need to understand this better.

    interesting you seem to be more worried about someone cursing than slander of an individual.

    Show me the slander. It seems to me to be an honest asessment of what happened.

    jorgab: Believe it or not, I don’t read all of the posts here. I pay more attention to the sites I work with that I make money from (I don’t earn a penny from this one). And believe me, I’ve consulted attorneys over this site as well.

    I am not the moderator, as you say, but a site manager – the difference is, I don’t have any responsibility to moderate anything that happens here. I try to keep it civil by doing some admin work around the cussing but that’s about it.

    That said, yes, I agree that there shouldn’t be personally identifiable information here but I’m also torn by the fact that these are business phone numbers and addresses that are available in advertising and phone books.

    The people referenced haven’t asked me to edit this post but I will anyway with the understanding that the POSTER is the responsible person here, not me.

    Next time, if you see something objectionable (or even legally risky) let me know and I’ll look into it. My information is easily available all over this site.

    And to everyone else, I really dislike the way this thread has degenerated into personal attacks. I am trying to stay out of it but this one is getting pretty mean. PLEASE stick to the topic. I would really appreciate it.

    - Rick

  48. Shomare Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 2:08 am

    The VW Experience – I work in the public eye every day. My name and title are well known and respected (I earned it) in the community in which I live. My (work) number is in the book and is readily accessible to those who would want or need it. People who have worked with me know that my word is my bond. I was raised this way and it is one on the guiding principals of my life.

    Want to know why I wouldnt care? Because I take pride in my work and stand by what I do. When I screw up, I acknowledge it, and make amends the best I can so that the other party feels that an effort was made to address their concern. If the person is unreasonable, as people can be at times, Im secure in knowing that I tried every thing I could do to resolve the matter and more importantly, I listened to the other party.

    In my work, if you treat people the way I was treated, you would get punched in the face and/or attacked.

    Besides, what purpose would anybody have in calling the numbers and people I listed? Their numbers are in the Syracuse New York Phone book and or listed at burdickcars.com as well. It would have been different if I had asked or encouraged others to call them and demand that my clutch be repaired.

    Again, my reason for being specific was for the purpose of accountability. I wrote down my experience verbatim and made an effort to let the events speak for them selves. If such events can be interpreted negatively by readers of this forum, maybe that is indicative of the experience I had. I never slandered anybody, just reported events.

  49. Clint Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 3:14 am

    The VW Experience – Ok I have been sitting back and not saying anything and just reading what ppl have to say, but I have to say something now… and this is directed towards JORGAB..
    what you said here (shomare. how would you respond if someone posted your full name and the phone # and name of place you worked at, just because someone was unhappy with the way you responded about something?) just goes to show that might want to figure out how to fix someone car then to give them the run around. You work at a dealership, you guys make a ton of profit off the sales of the cars, and make just as much in the service dept. ripping ppl off for labor and parts. it makes me sick when a service rep. insists to play by the rules and doesnt fix something just b/c VW didnt authorize it or whatever… just go to your general manager and tell him you have a customer that has a problem and it needs to be fixed.. if the general manager has any kind of a heart, he would fix the car and just write it off.. b/c I bet if his car was to break down it would be fixed that day in no time flat, and there would be no extra cost to him… oh he is the GM and that is a perk of the job.. no I dont think so… broken cars affect ppl I huge ways… oh man I could go on forever.. but now Im just rambling.. just fix the car.. replace it.. do whatever you have to in order for the person to have their car back, and not cost them a small fortune.
    Catch me of VWVortex.com @ Jetta01Wolfsburg

  50. jorgab Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 4:30 am

    The VW Experience – clint. you have no clue to what you are talking about. what do you do for a living? i have no problem with people getting frustated about their vehicles breaking down. and i know sometimes it can be difficult to cut through the red tape. vent all you you want if that is going to make you happy. i just do not think it is right to print someones full name where they work and there phone # across a forum for other people to see. remember there is always 2 sides to every story. just curious to what shomares dealership response to this situation might be

  51. Shomare Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 7:09 am

    The VW Experience – I’ll tell you their response…

    They fixed my car. Sent them this web page and another at myvwlemon.com so they were aware I was serious about my problem and was ready to take action.

    They did the right thing in the end. I’ll take my car back there for service because each side knows where the other stands now.

    I event mentioned that Scott really went to bat for us and thanked him in person and sang his praises here and in other post because without his efforts, I’d be out of luck or at least in court.

    Again no slander and there is no other side to this story. The clutch failed at 18K with normal daily driving. I said I would not pay for the repair. They stalled for a bit and then repaired it. End of story.

  52. jorgab Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 7:14 am

    The VW Experience – rick— my reply was in no means meant as a threat. you are a site manager not a moderator? even if you are a just a site manager you are still responsible for what is posted. In my job position i happen to deal with lawyers on a daily basis, so please don’t try to question me on that part. my question to you now is, is this site a publicly owned site, or is it owned by an individual? in any case if you have not figured it out, i do work for a vw dealership and my intent on this site, is to try to help and answer questions that people may have regarding their vehicles. I feel if i can help someone that is looking for it, then my job is done.

  53. rick Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 7:22 am

    The VW Experience – First, I find the fact that a VW dealship deals with lawyers on a daily basis just validates the reasons why this site exists!

    I also have found that few traditional lawyers understand how the Internet works. I am not responsible for what is posted here any more than AOL is responsible for what people say in chat rooms or on AIM. This is not a moderated site – that’s why your posts show up right away instead of going through an approval process, just like 99% of all Internet forums.

    If you feel like you have a job to do here, then do it. This track that you’re on isn’t it though.

  54. jorgab Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 8:12 am

    The VW Experience – to even insuate that i only deal with lawyers because of vw issues is an insult.the cold hard truth is that a lot of them are very satisfied vw or audi owners. look, I’m not going to sugar coat it. yes vw has issues. but in the years that i have spent in this line work (which is 12 years all with the same company but not at the same franchise) there issues do not seem to be any worse than the other manufactures i have represented in the past. for some reason though people seem to hold vw to a higher standard. hell even between audi and vw there is huge difference of opinion. but as a person with experience on both sides, i would take a vw over an audi any day. And i do own a 2000 jetta with 38,000 miles.

  55. Shomare Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 12:23 pm

    The VW Experience – What I posted was my account of events that led to the eventual replacement of my clutch.

    THe names listed are the actual names of the persons involved so that they can be held accountable for their lack of action / actions.

    These numbers are not private and the positions that people hold at the dealership is public information.

    I did not slander anyone in the post. All I did was take notes and post it here. Should any of them have a problem with what is posted here, maybe they should look at the actions they took.

    That being said:

    Thanks for the site and an oppertunity to take action and worn others. If I had not been polite, informed, and direct, things might have turned out worse.

    I’m glad that my VW works (for now) but I’ll never purchase another one because the effort, time and energy that went into getting it fixed was too much, not just this time, but every time!

  56. jorgab Said,

    October 29, 2004 @ 12:42 pm

    The VW Experience – shomare. how would you respond if someone posted your full name and the phone # and name of place you worked at, just because someone was unhappy with the way you responded about something?

  57. rick Said,

    November 6, 2004 @ 6:00 am

    The VW Experience –

    • “this post has changed direction countless times and is now headed for a “bridge out” sign. was there ever a point here?”

    Then why would you respond and float it to the top 8 days after it “died”?

    Jeesh… here we go again…

  58. jasenm Said,

    November 6, 2004 @ 11:09 am

    The VW Experience – this post has changed direction countless times and is now headed for a “bridge out” sign. was there ever a point here? if you order, for example, a memory chip for your computer, at, say, best buy, since ronster says i work there, they may tell you it will be in in 2-3 weeks. so if in 3 weeks its not there do you really expect the sales guy in the computer dept to know exactly where it is? really? do you think he can just pick up a phone and call joe-bob at vinnys trucking and say, “hey joe-bob, where u at with that memory chip?” and joe bob says, “im at the pump and munch in des moines, ill be there on monday, his chip is on the 3rd pallet, be there when im done havin relations with my sister flo” sounds unrealistic, right? in the same regard, THERE IS NO WAY TO TRACK THESE THINGS, CARS ARE NOT SHIPPED UPS, DHL, OR FEDEX!!!! and i do care, i want to get my customers on the road ASAP so that 1. i can make them happy 2. i can go on to other things. 3. i can get paid. make sense? EVERY car comany has this same problem. EVERY SINGLE FACTORY ORDER IS A HASSLE NO MATTER THE MAKE AND MODEL!!!! thanks.

  59. ZX1100F1 Said,

    November 9, 2004 @ 3:58 am

    The VW Experience – Rick, you already know the answer to this loaded question.

    Jasonms continuation of spewing excuses for why he is so incompetent never ceases to amaze me.
    All I can say is that; when I ordered several new Silverado trucks from the local Chevy dealer (for my business) they were able to track them every step of the way, two weeks before they hit the ground they pinpointed the exact day they would arrive.
    Last year I ordered my wife a new Mercedes and had pretty much a similar experience.
    I was dealing with professional salespeople though.

  60. Clint Said,

    November 10, 2004 @ 4:10 am

    The VW Experience – jasenm, your wrong.. your compairing apples to oranges… if i was to order a 22K car.. i better be able to know exactly where it is at all times… maybe cars dealers need to contract only one truck company and put GPS on the turcks so they can track every movement… but back to the point… a computer memory chip($100), who cares if its a few days late… a new car(22-25K), you better believe ppl are going to want to know where their bad investment is… so all i have to say is you all need to figure out a better way to track your new cars, their not just a cheap thing that you can live without.

  61. gerald palmer Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 2:49 am

    The VW Experience – shomare i am going to help you out a bit here. first this is just the start of your problems so find a way to laugh a little bit. and second don’t let anyone who you do not want to see hurt drive that P O S.

    i have a 2001 wolfsburg jetta 1.8t i have had the thing shut off on me losing my steering and breaks in the middle of a u shaped off ramp and i just got into an accident where i bit my touge off because my air bags did not go off nor did my seat belt lock, causing my head to leave very hugh indent in my windshield. i feel your pain but you have not even got a clue. my list of problems and lost money spending time in dealerships would be a 200 page novel. expect more problems and i would find a different car for your wife to drive and your child to ride in. i will not allow my 4 year old nephew even around my car cause i am affraid that something might fly off and hit him let alone allow him to ride in it. shit i am affraid to drive that thing. i feel safer on my motorcycle. hate to have to let you know your vw sucks as bad as every other vw out there.

  62. Beck Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 3:15 am

    The VW Experience – Well there you go guys! (esp. Paul) When you say that these bad experiences are just something that some simple hand tools and a good dealership could make better, you hear about somthing serious like this incident described. I have been warning everyone about how these Volksyugo glitches can develop into serious life threatening incidents. I had the same exact thing happen to my Passat on the highway, where the engine and everything else just died out, leaving me with no power steering, no brake boost and compromised controls going at 70 in a freeway full of cars. All because of the low quality ECU that they stuck into my car in the factory in Belgium, which decides to fritz out after two weeks of wonership. The system didn’t even go into a proper limp mode to keep things going, but just shut the engine down completely. How stupid is that! I was lucky that no one ended up ramming us from the back that day!

    So before you guys tell us that we are just nigh raving lunatics screaming the sky is falling as Paul noted yesterday, take note of incidents like these caused by Volksyugo’s low quality designs and put yourselves in our seats with maybe your family riding with you. Maybe you’ll finally get it!

  63. 297 Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 3:35 am

    The VW Experience – Thanks for leaving out the context.

    I told you that continuing to call VW Volksyugo would make you sound like a lunatic and no one new to the board would take you seriously (and you want to be taken seriously). I didn’t say you were one, I said you’ll sound like one unless you take it down a notch.

    As for the sky falling, that was in reference to your remarks concerning a model that hasn’t even come out yet.

    As for Mr. Palmer: what actions have you taken since the accident? This is serious and you should have been compensated. That said, VWs are much safer vehicles than Civics and Camrys, by virtue of design and standard equipment. The failure of this standard equipment should be investigate when pertaining to your vehicle — and before beck goes off on a rant that these vehicles are unsafe, I’ve hear stories on the other side of the argument where people survived because of the safety features VW put in the car.

    We can all bring our individual stories to bear and we can all regret and empathize. But the fact of the matter is a person’s story cannot be taken as representative of every VW out there until it is collected and gathered with other like or opposing stories.

    So do what you need to do, Gerald, to receive compensation and satisfaction; you deserve it. And if you haven’t gotten rid of the car, do so now. Get something else and avoid VWs for the next five years if you want if it’ll make you feel better. That’s your choice and your experience has caused VW to lose a customer. But I also know of others who will go ahead and buy another VW because they survived due to their car’s safety measures, and to them, go for it.

    Unless you find a high percentage of VWs suffering the failures your car suffered, you cannot accuse the company of a defective model. You got a lemon. That sucks and I’m glad you survived. But unless you are one of a majority of failures, you just plain got unlucky in getting a lemon.

    That may sound harsh, but so is accusing a company of gross negligence in customer safety because of your single experience.

    Believe me or not, that’s just as much a fact as your single car’s failure is a fact.

    So yeah, never buy a VW again. But telling me my car is unsafe because your car failed is just as good as someone telling me they lived because their VW saved them and I should be glad I own one.

  64. 297 Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 3:37 am

    The VW Experience – Don’t bother bringing up the coilpacks: VW acknowledged the problem to a bad batch sent by a third-party contractor, and they issued a general recall. Had they denied the problem and let it go unfixed, resulting in car failures and accidents and possibly even death, THEN you’d have a valid point.

  65. gerald palmer Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 4:05 am

    The VW Experience – i am talking with an attorney on this and plan to sue the sh*t out of them.i tried to get the car considered a lemon but the same thing never happened enough. but these types of cases usually take a year or so to work out. i feel $3,000 a day for every day i could not eat solid foods sounds fair for pain and suffering plus i still want a refund on that pos. well they did have a recall for the actuator that sets the air bag off.it was hush hush though. i found out from a friend that fixed all my recall issues at a shop that builds gt races cars well sorry all sorts of race cars now. plus i never said all vw’s had that air bag problem i was reffuring to the coil pack misfireing that i found out about well before anyone else and lived with it till there was a recall. the one coil pack slowly died on me so it would shut down the engine i would restart and all was fine till about a month after the recall when another coil pack died.

  66. gerald palmer Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 4:09 am

    The VW Experience – the problem with the coil packs is that the quality control sucks. they kept popping off the spark plug. so i had it go to my friends shop where they build gt race cars and he said that i was missing the coil pack bracket that holds them down. but after trying to find the part he found out it did not exist so he made a custom brushed aluminum one which stopped the problem. the funny thing is that there where predrilled holes for it that is why he thought there was a part for that. vw must have over looked that. or it is just that great enginering the do.

  67. Beck Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 4:30 am

    The VW Experience – “SINGLE experience”…Riiiight!

  68. Beck Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 4:46 am

    The VW Experience – Problem is Paul, of ALL the different brand cars that I have owned through the years, never tried to kill me out in traffic as I had described above. and what about the recent incident I had (2 weeks ago), when the ABS just decided not to work when I put on the brakes on a rain slick Interstate north of San Francisco, after going over a crest and seeing the traffic stopped ahead of me. My wheels all locked up and hydroplaned, again doing 70MPH. My evil Passat took me for a spining dance for about 100 yards towards the back of a stopped minibus and a Mustang. Only my good presence of mind and driving skill helped me regain control of the spin and prevented me from crashing into them. I missed the stopped cars by mere inches. No warning lights from the ABS system, no vibration at the pedal, nothing. Just did not kick in at all. As far as my car is concerned, the ABS is supposedly operational. I wish you were riding with me that day cause you might have developed a hundred grey hairs on your head after that.

    Volksyugo bad quality components and design could easily cause a trip to the hospital.

    But don’t worry, that was just another “single” incident, I didn’t die after all! I have other life threatening incidents happen to me in my evil car, but forget it, they wouldn’t make a difference to you anyway.

    Riiight?!

    As to getting rid of the car, easier said than done. I’m not in a financial position presently to replace it. All I have to look forward to, is finally paying it off in April next year. If I have the money by then, I will gladly sell it to you or anyone else that just can’t get enough of Volksyugo. I will even include all the little parts that fell off it through the years and all the ones I had to replace because they couldn’t stand up to everyday driving and decided to break or burn out before their time (Oh, you will just love all those ten dollar a piece, miniature instrument panel bulbs I’ve replaced over the years, they’re just so teensy weensy cute little overpriced crappy fragile little things!) Riiight?!!!! P.S., with all that’s going wrong with the car right now, it must be only worth as salvage junk anyway. Right!

  69. gerald palmer Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 4:53 am

    The VW Experience – my warning was to shomare. already having a traction control and clutch problem there is a safty issue in the winter months. not good traction on ice could be a problem. i would leave injurys a deaths to the things we can not control like the flu that took my 14 month old niece from my family last dec 23. not to a faulty car. the car is something that can be avoided. you even might say i am paranoid but my bike is a 2002 suzuki gsxr 750 which was stolen a few months ago. i do wheelies i have had to 181 mph. i am do not care about my safety but i do care about others. and i hate the fact that i dumped as much money as i did into that car to make sure everthing was working properly only to find out that vw has yet to fix my air bag recall. i guess i have to take issue to my friend as well. a vw certfied tech knows nothing but an asc certfied tech had to take a pretty envolved test to be able to call him self that. i have never had a vw tech fix my car. and that is vw’s biggest problem they have techs that don’t know there ass from first base. and that is there biggest safety issue as well. plus i loved there policie on fixing the coil packs one at a time. that only caused me to have my engine shut off more times than reqiuered. if they cared about are safety then they would have replced all of them at once. and in that u shaped off ramp i almost hit a tree but lucky me i managed to get power back to my power stearing and brakes back just in time, but the engine did not restart. they could have left power to the those parts if they designed there car better. but no when the engine shuts down so dose every thing else. all that would reqiure is a better program on the ecu. i know about this having been a programer at Kennedy Space Center. and as for your six month oil changes there buddy keep that up. see how oil beggins to break down after three. no matter how many miles. get to know a thing or two about cars before you start try to talk.

  70. gerald palmer Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 5:13 am

    The VW Experience – p.s. to all sorry head trauma and pain killers are not helping my spelling

  71. Shomare Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 10:11 am

    The VW Experience – Yes indeed this thread has changed direction but not by my doing.

    What you say about tracking is false.

    VW was able to track my car enough to let me know that it had been sitting in port for weeks in Boston and that there had been no effort made to expedite the transporting process despite having been mislead that we would take delivery of our car before the new year by our salesman.

    There is a huge difference between a 100 dollar computer part and a 23K car! If they dont know where my computer part is life goes on. If they fail to produce my car, its a major inconvenience that impact upon my work and family.

    Whenever Ive ordered any other make Ive received the car in a timely fashion as promised by the dealership. The worst thing that ever happened before is that a dealer failed to get the plates for my car and as such I drove it for the weekend with dealer plates on the car.

    VW has quality issues that apparently they are trying to address but couple those frustrating quality problems with sleazy salesmen (as if there are any other kind) and disreputable management and you can see why one might swear off the brand.

  72. 297 Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 10:52 am

    The VW Experience – That said, customer satisfaction jumped up this year compared to last year’s dismal report (second to last). VW appears to be working on the problem — it’ll be conclusive if next year’s report shows further improvement.

  73. Clint Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 11:47 am

    The VW Experience – Well thanks for reiterating what I said Shomare… 100 dollar computer chip… life goes on.. 23k car… life come to a holt… I agree with Paul looks like VW is trying to be better to us, but we still have the main issue with VW… all the faulty parts… but like Paul says.. I have a VW and I like it and it hasnt given my many problems… but my next car wont be a VW b/c of the ongoing efforts of other car companies to produce quality/ performance cars that are better then any Vdub. Ex: Nissan is bringing the Skyline to the US in like 06 or 07… this is going to be one bad ass car for the price… around 35K for full leather seats, 400HP, twin turbo, rear wheel drive… on and on and on… now thats what ppl like us want!
    Good luck to you Shomare with any future cars and your luck with VWoA. And I am glade you have been able to get your car finally fixed and running to expectations!

  74. 297 Said,

    November 11, 2004 @ 12:24 pm

    The VW Experience – With regards to faulty parts on the MkIV: VW appears to have reclaimed some of the third-party parts it contracted out to third-party vendors. One example I read about was the door module. This was formerly contracted out — the MkV has an in-house design. Perhaps an attempt at directly addressing problems with the MkIV third-party parts?

    My next car will be a wagon. I haven’t decided yet what wagon, seeing as I’m still three years away from it. I’d prefer it to be turbocharged, though. I like the punch. :D

    I wonder if there’ll be such a thing as a turbocharged hybrid wagon by then…. oooooo.

  75. Beck Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 4:41 am

    The VW Experience – Riiiiight! Typical Takeda response. It’s always our fault! Riiiight! What’s the point, you’re the one that’s all noise to us with answers like that. Riiight!

    Gerald, make sure he isn’t in the jury when you sue. cause it might end up all your fault too! Riiiight!!!!

  76. 297 Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 4:47 am

    The VW Experience – I already feel Gerald needs comepnsation so let’s not involve his current difficulties with your crusade to ridicule.

    So much for your efforts in constructive dialogue.

  77. Beck Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 4:52 am

    The VW Experience – Your own crusade of selective response just help to discredit you. When you can’t handle it you just brush it off with statements that you directed towards me. Just keep it coming and lets see who looks silly in the end.
    Riiiiight!

  78. 297 Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 4:56 am

    The VW Experience – Okay, I’ll bite. Let’s hear it, everything I’ve said on this board that displays my selectivity, things I have written with clear intent to praise VW as a flawless vehicle and that everything wrong with yours is your fault. Bring it all out.

    You have the floor.

  79. Beck Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 5:01 am

    The VW Experience – So what’s the purpose of that stupid crack about me maybe avoiding driving 70! Oh great one!
    You’re the one who’se injecting unintelligent dialogue. I just tell the facts on what’s been going on with my car. And if you can’t even see the seriousness of that close call I had. You’re certainly clueless of what really counts. People could have been hurt because of the flaw in my ABS system. It’s no *&^&ing joke! That’s just one example of you being selective and blind to thereal problems we have with our Volksyugo!
    Riiight!. By the way, thank you for the “”Riiight”" expression it really works when I argue with you! So Appropriate!

  80. 297 Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 5:13 am

    The VW Experience – It wasn’t a stupid crack, I really wanted to know. Why would you drive your car at high speed on a wet road if you were leery about its safety?

    Afterward, did you have the ABS systems checked after that near-accident? What was its condition and did you report this to the dealer?

    The problem between us is that I’ve honestly become so desensitized to your posts that when you do write something about a personal experience where you were in danger it glosses over me. That sounds bad, but that’s the truth of the matter.

    We can continue to hash this out, get real angry at each other, call each other names and make this board our little playground before Rick bans us from the board; or we can call a ceasefire.

    I apologize if I appeared insensitive to your near-accident. My reasons above may sound callous and cold, but they’re honest and stem directly from our recent diatribes over the other threads. You glossed over my posts, picked and chose choice sentences to use out of context, and that really annoyed me to the point where I glossed over your posts. I truly am glad you didn’t hit those cars and do want to know what you found out about the ABS afterward.

    This doesn’t mean you’re okay with me or my position. Nor does it mean I’m okay with yours. But we can at least abandon this useless back and forth we’ve been doing and go back to addressing the problems people have with their cars.

    Truce. Deal?

  81. 297 Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 5:23 am

    The VW Experience – Concerning your ABS, beck, this is interesting. Depending the part number of your ABS module, you might have a possible class-action or personal lawsuit concerning the part. From a glance at the posts, ABS module 8E0614111P appears to be failing far too often. The part has been replaced by 8E0614111Q, and a search on Impex Foreign Auto Parts for 8E0614111P results in a find of 8E0614111Q (I like their site as they frequently do this to provide you with the most up to date part).

    You might want to see just how actionable this is — you may find yourself able to get rid of the car faster than you think.

    Of course, for anyone else out there who still wants to keep their car and are concerned about the ABS, the part has been replaced for free even when out of warranty by some people who posted on the tech board I linked to.

  82. Beck Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 5:33 am

    The VW Experience – First of all, just to close that last issue up about driving 70 in the rain.. all I can say is, “”he who is not guilty, let him cast the first stone”" Driving 70 in the rain is something that 99.9% of all of us do (Doesn’t Volkwagen pride themselve for producing good high speed handling cars on the speed limit free Autobahns and Autostradas?). Please be honest on that one. I’m sure you’re not innocent like the rest of the driving world isn’t. Maybe if I was going 80, 90 or 100, then maybe you have a point.
    Secondly, please read all my posts replying to you on this site. I would challenge you to find anything like name calling directed towards you. On the contrary, it has been you recently that has been directing personal insult to me with statements like “”raving lunatic”" and all that topped off with your selective insensitivity to actual dangerous events that happened to me (I never brought it up previously, cause I had a feeling that you would have reacted to it like you did.) I would definitely want a truce with you. You sound like a very intelligent person that can help a lot of people figure out what’s wrong with their “”Volksyugos”".
    And about the term “”Volksyugos”", you know it’s a tongue and cheeck joke about our cars, meant to cut the edge from our discussions. I’m sure we can be all mature enough to realize that and not take something directed to a company, detached from most of us, personally. My problem is not with satisfied customers of Volkswagen like you, but the company itself and the unhelpful systems that support it (Bad dealerships).
    Right?!

  83. 297 Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 5:39 am

    The VW Experience – No, you never name called, I don’t have to look through your posts about that. But I know you misunderstood me when I suggested that constantly saying Volksyugo might make you sound like a nigh raving lunatic to a new user. It’s right there: “”You’re better off leaving such labels out of your posts — they’ll earn more respect that way, rather than marking you as a nigh-raving lunatic.”"

    I suppose you can take it to mean I’m calling you one, but my point was while old users know your tongue-in-cheek ways, new, disgruntled customers who find this site won’t.

    If you took it as a personal attack, that was not my intent (hence my “”Personal barbs? Riiight!”" comment).

    It all is beginning to sound like an episode of Three’s Company, isn’t it?

    Oh, well. Truce. And let me know what you found out about the ABS and if the info on that technical board was of use.

  84. 297 Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 5:44 am

    The VW Experience – Forgot to mention, about driving 70mph. No, I’m just as guilty about it, but to be honest, I do so because I’m confident about the car (especially with the tires on it, which are rated excellent in the wet). I am not lying when I say I will not drive my girlfriend’s Camry at that speed if the road is wet enough that it looks like it might be a problem.

    Of course, I have no idea what the road looked like that day you were driving, so it certainly is possible I’d drive 70 on it with the Camry.

    I guess I just can’t see why you’d drive 70 under those conditions if you weren’t confident about the car.

    Regardless, ABS failure is a serious problem and if you find something actionable you need to pursue it. The goal of a site like this, in my eyes, is to make these problems apparent enough that it forces VW to take note.

  85. Beck Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 6:09 am

    The VW Experience – Truce!

    About the ABS, It’s been giving me warning lights for half of the time I owned the car. I bring it in for checking and service, and the typical response is, “”The sensor was just dirty, we cleaned it off and it’s contacts. Warning light goes off but will usually go on again after a a few weeks. Go back in for a check, (with usually a different dealer). Same diagnosis, ABS warning light off for a while….this has gone on constatnly with my car throughout the years I owned it. Doesn’t matter which dealer I go to. So after 5 years of it, I had to make a conclusion that it’s a dirty sensor problem because Volkswagen originally.designed it where it gets too dirty to quickly. ABS pump checked out OK all the time. This non-functioning without warning problem is very recent. I can feel the system function once in a while when I go over grates and stell plates on the road. So there is never a reason lately to think something is wrong. The ABS warning light has been quiet for the last year. So no warnings. The car is going into service soon and it will be borught up. I can almost hear the service manager. “”New ABS pump required, 2500 bucks please!”" Sadly, I think the car’s only worth that much by now with all the stuff falling off of it. So you see, it’s a lose – lose proposition to me with this 97 Passat. I’m just looking forward to paying it off and getting rid of it by March. Another sad thing is, my present finanancial condition, as a lot of us in this reccessive economy, might not make that easy. But with this Passat being a genuine money pit (It’s now an old car, and it will just get worse!), I might just grin and bear it and buy something as you might call a boring Japanese economy car that will most likely not break down for 200,000 miles and cost pennies to run.
    And that’s just one story about one system that has been constantly malfunctioning on the car. You might notice that this ABS system problem is very common to Volkswagen if you read the different Volkswagen owner sites. I hate to repeat it, but all the other cars I owned with ABS NEVER had any problems with their braking systems. From the time I bought them to the time I sold them. Hence the frustration that comes along with all this. I would have to write a book to give you the whole story about my car and the way it has challenged me constantly because of quality and design problems that plague it……… Now that might be a good Idea! Nah!! Maybe Michael Moore can do a better job! He looks like a VW owner for some reason, but he most likely own an air cooled Beetle which from my experience was much more reliable than these “”modern”" Volkswagens!

  86. 297 Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 6:28 am

    The VW Experience – Considering the slow economy, a cheap, reliable car with decent handling is the best choice.

    A ‘97? That’s a B4…. hmm.. that ABS moduel discussion doesn’t apply then, that’s for B5s. If you can, when you take it to the dealer mention the near-collision. See if they’ll do a freebie on the “diagnostics machine” and if they, get them to give you the DTCs. I’d be interested to see if it reports anything. If the ABS system suffers an electrical fault, the entire system shuts down and leaves you with conventional brakes — this sounds like what happened to you.

    Yeah, I owned a ‘69 Beetle as a teenager and it’s really what led me to owning an ‘01 New Beetle. I’d like to get one from the junkyard one day and restore it. That’d be fun.

  87. rick Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 7:25 am

    The VW Experience – Jeesh. Can we Arafat this thread now? Or do we have to stick around for the “”kumbaya”" sing-along?

    Sorry, this is added later (thanks to that fabulous EDIT YOUR POST feature!) I didn’t want to dismiss this without saying that both Beck and paultakeda have good things to say. I LIKE the back-and-forth when it’s done well, as I’m sure many visitors do. Nobody wants to come here to read a very one-sided view of things, nor do they want to read a bunch of childish taunts (which others have done). Nobody would ever get banned for a lively debate! Besides… how do you ban people again? I’ll have to look that up….

  88. Chombi Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 9:25 am

    The VW Experience – Let’s all go to Kirsten’s Skipper thread! There a lot of space to play there!

  89. rick Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 9:45 am

    The VW Experience – LOL!

    Now I feel bad for her… I’m sure she had something important to say…

  90. 297 Said,

    November 12, 2004 @ 10:28 am

    The VW Experience – Gerald, if a part was missing, then you may have received a car that came off the assembly line where quality control failed. That may be helpful to your lawsuit. What may not be helpful is your friend’s addition — defense may use that against you. Your lawyer should know how to handle that, in any case. Hopefully, the suit doesn’t go to trial and VW compensates you to your satisfaction without argument. Considering the complete systems failure you experience, I really can’t see why they wouldn’t. Please keep us updated on your story in your own, new thread.

    As for oil, people have done oil studies for their own cars — driving habit and where it is driven plus the performance of that individual engine dictates how badly oil deteriorates, some have gone 25k without a change in filter or synthetic oil — I never did a study, so I’ll probably stick to every 10k or 1 year. Yes, oil begins to deteriorate after a certain point, but engine technology and oil technology has developed such that this deterioration does not affect performance or the life of the engine until a much later period than the old muscle-car 3,000k interval.

    beck, the impulse to throw things I’ve said back at me is better done when the context is appropriate. Otherwise, it just looks like noise to me. As for your personal experience — if you honestly believe your car is a deathtrap, stop driving it at 70mph. No, really, take precautions when driving the vehicle and keep to slower lanes, drive with more space in front of you, etc. Driving 70mph on a rain-slicked highway? In a car you don’t trust?

    Gee. I don’t know what to say.

Leave a Comment

You must be logged in to post a comment.